Prabhupāda: ...find out wine and woman. That's all.
Girirāja: [reading from Kṛṣṇa book] "While they were thus enjoying themselves..."
Prabhupāda: But in America I don't think there is such thing.
Dr. Patel: Because, these nightclubs and all these things is of this type.
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Dr. Patel: Sex, merriment. I have not seen a single nightclub, though I studied in England for two years. [break]
Prabhupāda: ...Nārada, but still they are sinful. Such a great personality like Nārada they have seen, but still they are sinful. Go on.
Girirāja: "As such, the great sage Nārada considered that because the demigods Nalakūvara and Maṇigrīva were so infatuated by false prestige, they should be put in a condition of life devoid of opulence." [break]
Prabhupāda: ...bench, standing. The small children, they are punished, "Stand up on the bench." It is like that.
Dr. Patel: All vegetables are in tamas, in tamas [indistinct].
Prabhupāda: No. Some of them, fruitful, those trees for supplying nice fruits, nice flowers, they are in the goodness. Everywhere the three qualities are working.
Yaśomatīnandana: There may be dog in the mode of goodness?
Prabhupāda: No, dog is an animal. He is in the ignorance. But the cow is in goodness. Sattva-raja-tamo.
Dr. Patel: Horse is in rajas.
Prabhupāda: Horse, lions. The monkey is in tamas.
Dr. Patel: And animal is in tamas and rajas...
Prabhupāda: Everything, there are three qualities, everywhere.
Dr. Patel: Everywhere. But more rajas is in monkeys, because they are more active. These particular... [break]
Prabhupāda: They are researching for something which is useless. Therefore tamas. Rajas-tamo-bhavaḥ kāma-lobhādayaś ca ye [SB 1.2.19]. This is the effect of rajas-tamas = kāma and lobha, greedy and always hankering after.
Dr. Patel: But sometimes real scientists speak out the truth. [break]
Prabhupāda: Don't give pain to others.
Dr. Patel: Don't give...?
Prabhupāda: Others, painful condition. If you feel pain by certain condition, that is...
Dr. Patel: Ātmavat sarva bhūteṣu.
Girirāja: "Generally it is seen that one who has risen from a poverty-stricken life and becomes wealthy creates some charitable institution at the end of his life..." [break]
Prabhupāda: ...goes to market and gets some this... What is called, bhūta, bhūta?
Dr. Patel: What is, bhūta,
Prabhupāda: Corns. [break]
Dr. Patel: Corn, or this...
Yaśomatīnandana: Mottai[?]? [indistinct]
Dr. Patel: But that is why I say that rasanā [tongue] is not so strong as śiṣṇa [genital].
Prabhupāda: No, if you do not allow rasanā to enjoy much, śiṣṇa will be subdued.
Dr. Patel: But still, I mean personally, for myself, I don't have any taste for any food. In fact I have been taking all the food together just like the sannyāsīs, and I don't have any taste. But still I have from within me I don't find that form of sex carrying out, though I am a scientist.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Caitanya Mahāprabhu used to say that "Sex life is so strong that even if I see one wooden female form I become excited."
Dr. Patel: That is why I feel the same thing.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So this is not unnatural. Caitanya Mahāprabhu tells this because this cannot be avoided. But by knowledge it can be avoided.
Dr. Patel: We were talking the same thing.
Prabhupāda: Yes, by knowledge. Yes. But "Because I am excited, therefore I have to do this," that is not good.
Dr. Patel: But then I found out the solution for this. As soon as you feel excitement... [break] Then you have nothing to do with it.
Prabhupāda: Therefore knowledge.
Dr. Patel: Yes. That I have started practicing this for some time. And I feel a great solace in that.
Prabhupāda: That has been recommended by Śaṅkarācārya, that "Why you are attracted by these forms? It is only a combination of flesh and marrow. That's all."
Dr. Patel: No, but who is attracted? The indriya is attracted. I am beyond indriya. That also you think. I am master of the indriya. [break]
Prabhupāda: So long we are associated... The example I have given many times, that I am sitting on a car, and the car there is accident. I am not car. Still, I am excited, "Oh, my car is lost. Why you have struck my car?" There is so much quarrel. But it is a fact, he knows that "I am not the car." That is called abhiniveśa.
Dr. Patel: Wrong orientation.
Prabhupāda: Yes. [break] Cāṇakya Paṇḍita says, matṛvat para-dareṣu: "Always think of other's wife as mother."
Dr. Patel: Mātṛvat...
Prabhupāda: Yes. [break] ...also have to die.
Dr. Patel: We die, don't mind, but we want others to die as Muslims. We want to die them as Hindus. [break] ...supersonic soundness.
Prabhupāda: Supersonic? What is that? Any circumstance, the ruling power is nature. He cannot avoid that. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā [Bg. 7.14]. [break] ...more their senses are turbulent. This is also... Therefore there is one tapasā brahmacāryena [SB 6.1.13], and the word anaśana, anaśana, "not eating." Eating should be reduced.
Dr. Patel: Tapasā brahmacāryena damena... [break]
Prabhupāda: ...yamena, damena. There are so many. Out of that, there is one, anaśana, anaśana, not eating.
Dr. Patel: Anaśana. Ana-asana.
Prabhupāda: Yes. [break]
Girirāja: "...not very turbulent, he cannot become violent." [break]
Prabhupāda: ...yuktāhāra. Not to eat more, not to eat less. That is required. [break] ...yes, when I was alone in Baroda, I was making my customers for Back to Godhead. So I entered one gentleman's house, and from the porch he was, "Don't come! Don't come! Don't come!" (laughs] Immediately.
Dr. Patel: Baroda was a very small place then. [indistinct] place. [break]
Prabhupāda: ...if I go to a place, jataji bhikṣā dijiye, so everyone will be compassionate. And it is our duty, at least in Vedic civilization, that when a sannyāsī comes he is received = "Aiye, aiye, Mahārāja, betiye." Still. Still in the villages they do that. Just like it is mentioned in the śāstra that brahmacārī and sannyāsīs should be taken as the sons of the society.
Dr. Patel: In Poona, even today in Poona... [break]
Prabhupāda: They are trained like that, very good. [break] It is compulsory that every man should become a mendicant for some time.
Indian man (1): They must have experience of that. [break]
Prabhupāda: ...there is a temple, Tarakeśvara, in Hoogli district. So Lord Śiva... So people, I mean to say, pray that "If my this disease is cured" or "If I get this victory, I shall become a sannyāsī for a month." [laughs] So that system is going on. They become sannyāsīs for one month. There are hundreds and thousands.
Dr. Patel: They, according to our Hindu... [break]
Prabhupāda: This is called "one-month sannyāsī." That is not mentioned in the śāstra, but it has come into custom.
Dr. Patel: Custom. But according to śāstra... [break]
Prabhupāda: ...and if he returns, he is called vāntāśī, yes, "eating the vomit."
Indian man (1): Before giving sannyāsa, the teacher will take proper care that his mind is already peaceful and all... [break]
Prabhupāda: ...obeisances, we take out our shoes. That is a system.
Indian man (1): Even the hat...
Prabhupāda: Hat, yes. [break] ...naked is not civilization. It is not civilization.
Dr. Patel: That means practice tapas right from the beginning of your days... [break]
Prabhupāda: The body is changed.
Dr. Patel: It's not icchā-dveṣa samutthena dvandva-mohena [Bg. 7.27]? [break]
Prabhupāda: That past life, because the body is changed, you forget.
Dr. Patel: Some of the people also...
Prabhupāda: Some of the...
Dr. Patel: I don't know how it is. It is difficult to explain.
Prabhupāda: That is special. That is special.
Dr. Patel: There is a big research going on in the parapsychology here in India and America.
Prabhupāda: No, it is by the grace of God one can remember about his past life. [break] ...practical experience. In our family, my mother's eldest sister, her son of a previous birth came to see her. Old man, very old man. [break] This is called illusion.
Dr. Patel: All relations of the son, child, wife, husband, all these are of the... [break]
Prabhupāda: ...just like in the river sometimes several straws will meet together...
Dr. Patel: [indistinct Sanskrit]
Prabhupāda: ...and again they disperse. [break] We get our body and mix together, and again we are dispersed by the waves of time. [break] ...at the end we shall see Kṛṣṇa. [break]
Girirāja: " '...the original Personality of Godhead, master of all mystic powers, learned brāhmaṇas know very well that this cosmic manifestation is an expansion of Your potency.' " [break]
Prabhupāda: ...and Nalakūvara, but He remained bound up.
Indian man (1): About His līlā?
Prabhupāda: Yes. [break] Yaśodāmāyī is more powerful than Kṛṣṇa. Eh?
Indian man (1): No, devotees are more powerful always.
Prabhupāda: [laughing] Just see. He liberated Nalakūvara, but He remained bound up by the rope of Yaśodāmāyī. [break] ...children. [break] ...some conjugal love.
Dr. Patel: Then He became eight years old. How could any gopī have a conjugal love with a boy of seven or eight years?
Indian man (1): Spiritual love.
Prabhupāda: That is not this love. That is a different love.
Dr. Patel: Conjugal love is mādhurya-rāsa.
Prabhupāda: Mādhurya-rāsa, yes... [break] ...eat along with my father. Yes. Unless I come, father will not...
Dr. Patel: But you were brought up in a big city, but I was brought up in a small village. Actually... [break]
Prabhupāda: The same. It doesn't matter whether it is in the village or town.
Dr. Patel: In the villages we eat more. We used to buy [Hindi]... [break] [end]