[in a car]
Prabhupāda: Relative means. Relativity to the human society, so a dog is enjoying sex life on the street, why don’t you do that?
Devotee: Well there are coming to that, practically. They make advance in sex pleasure.
Prabhupāda: That is the statement in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisraṁpunaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām [SB 7.5.30], adānta-gobhir uncontrolled senses they are going to the darkest regions of hell.
Devotee: Ha.
Prabhupāda: Adānta-gobhir.
matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā
mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha-vratānām
adānta-gobhir ....
adānta-gobhir everywhere. Their...philosophy is animalism. [break] there is one word ucitāhāraḥ, ucitāhāraḥ, ucita means exactly, ucita.... [break]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, in Maṇipur the rāsa-līlā is conducted almost every year and one of my uncles he condemns that. How can we imitate the activities of the Lord? So is this authorised, it is done every year and sometimes they spend a lot of money on rāsa-līlā.
Prabhupāda: Rāsa-līlā festival may be observed but you cannot imitate that. Rāsa-līlā festival is observed in Calcutta also [indistinct] the Deity is decorated, many people come to see, it becomes a festival. Not that people imitates rāsa-līlā.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: [indistinct] some children they take the part of Rādhā and one child take the part the Kṛṣṇa and then.
Prabhupāda: That can be played.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Ah.
Prabhupāda: [indistinct]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: In fact these are done by professional singers and they take about six months to. For the festival to prepare and about thousands of people come. Sometimes the Palace of the King and almost everywhere in Maṇipur.
Prabhupāda: That’s nice. We can also do like that. . Rāsa-līlā.
Devotee: Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: [indistinct] also, so suppose a rich man he is gratifying his senses, when is the same standard in everyone?
Śyāmasundara: [indistinct] in America even the poorest man has the pleasures of a rich man.
Prabhupāda: But where is that poor man?
Śyāmasundara: Has cars, has television, food.
Prabhupāda: But. Do you think everyone’s standard is the same?
Śyāmasundara: No but even the poor man can enjoy.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Śyāmasundara: By material standards, a poor man.
Prabhupāda: What is his pleasure? A rich man’s car and the poor man’s car is the same standard?
Śyāmasundara: Well.
Prabhupāda: A rich man’s apartment and poor man’s apartment same standard?
Śyāmasundara: Well it’s relative, a poor man he’s never had anything and he has nice...
Prabhupāda: Then everyone. There is no need of making attempt that everyone should become. Everyone is comfortable in his own standard...
Bali Mardan: They always want to develop.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Śyāmasundara: Technology, develop [indistinct]
Prabhupāda: No, no however you are developed. The first class, second class, third class is always there.
[Exit car]
Same standard you cannot bring everyone on the same standard, the...
Śyāmasundara: Of course they say that everyone has the opportunity to develop their standard.
Prabhupāda: That’s all right. Everyone has the opportunity but where is the chance of coming to that level? There is no such chance.
Karāndhara: [indistinct] the poor.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Karāndhara: They say that everyone is in a democracy, everyone has a chance.
Prabhupāda: Chance everyone has, that nobody denies that, but why the chance is not being available to everyone?
Karāndhara: Well that’s what they’re trying to do.
Prabhupāda: Trying to do is no, everyone says, "I’m trying to do." Then where is the level?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is just imagination.
Prabhupāda: Imagination. durāśayāḥ that is called durāśayāḥ impossible hope. Bhāgavata says, durāśayāḥ. durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ [SB 7.5.31]. They are trying to become happy through the extension of external energy. That is durāśayāḥ, that hope will never be. Now suppose everybody has got a car, then where is the road? Suppose everyone gets a car, then where is the road?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: They cannot move.
Śyāmasundara: We can make enough, they think that they can make enough roads.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: [laughter]
Prabhupāda: That means hope against hope.
Devotees: [laughter]
Prabhupāda: You create problem and work for your. That is therefore they are called asses. That is hoping, "now I shall be getting this twig."You know the...The washer man sits on his back and shows him one vegetable and twig and [indistinct].
Devotees: [laughter]
Prabhupāda: It is also increasing. Never gets. That is ass. And [indistinct]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Even now, even now everybody doesn’t have a car but now there is a problem of pollution because of the exhaust coming out of the unburned gas.
Prabhupāda: Ah.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: It makes the. Especially in Los Angeles in the city area, in the daytime when there is sunshine there is a lot of chemical reactions with the sunshine and unburned gas coming out of the automobiles [indistinct]
Prabhupāda: Yes, [indistinct]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: It’s very dangerous.
Prabhupāda: Even motor passes, the gas odour is so.
Śyāmasundara: They think they can make adjustments, they can create some.
Prabhupāda: That is durāśayāḥ, that is. They think they will be able to make adjustment but never be.
Śyāmasundara: They have made anti-smog devices to reduce pollution but.
Prabhupāda: That means creating problem and struggling for it, working hard for it, that is their game, that’s all.
Śyāmasundara: They just create another problem.
Karāndhara: Now they’re running out of gasoline. Anyway they made so many cars and everyone has killed themselves in accidents.
Prabhupāda: Where is the adjustment?
Śyāmasundara: It takes so many investments to make[?].
Prabhupāda: Durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ andhā, everything is explained in. andhāḥ, the rascal blind leaders leading them, andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās [SB 7.5.31].
Svarūpa Dāmodara: The rich, we practically see in all fields.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Problems of the problems.
Prabhupāda: Here.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Once one is solved then another will come up.
Prabhupāda: Andhāḥ, because there are simply problems therefore it is called material otherwise preaching Vaikuṇṭha, Vaikuṇṭha means no problems, vigata-kuṇṭha that is Vaikuṇṭha. As soon as there is problems that is material.
Vaikuṇṭha means no problems, that is real. Everyone is without any problems. Even if they have got motor cars and nice apartments and everything where is the problem solved? The death problem? The disease problem? How it is solved? They cannot solve problems, simply [indistinct]
Karāndhara: There are many people who acknowledge that, they say yes everything is always imperfect but they don’t believe there is a perfection.
Prabhupāda: Not [indistinct]
Karāndhara: They are very sceptical.
Prabhupāda: No they may not feel it. But you’re feeling imperfection means there is perfection that very feeling. Suppose that there is perfection otherwise why you are feeling imperfect?
Karāndhara: They sense in a lack of something.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Karāndhara: If you’re feeling thirsty there must be water.
Prabhupāda: Yes. [break] darkness means there must be light. [indistinct] stand first always... avicyuto 'rthaḥ kavibhir nirūpito [SB 1.5.22] puṁsas tapasaḥśrutasya vā. Education means enlightenment whatever you have learned that should be used for serving the supreme. idaṁ hi puṁsas tapasaḥśrutasya vā. Eh?..Japanese [indistinct] Ah. It is vegetables and fishes, so those who are fish-eaters, it will be very palatable. Fish-eaters they mix vegetable with fish. So it is already combined.
Shyasasundar: [indistinct] [loud background noise of the waves] in India?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Shyasasundar: Seaweed?
Prabhupāda: In Bengal especially.
Shyasasundar: Seaweed?
Prabhupāda: No I do not know.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: They’re vegetables.
Prabhupāda: They use vegetable with fish. That is very palatable.
[brief conversation with Svarūpa Dāmodara dāsa in Hindi]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Ha. [Hindi]
Prabhupāda: [Hindi]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Eh?
Prabhupāda: [Hindi]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh.
Prabhupāda: [Hindi]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Besides this, [indistinct] they are saying that in a few years the food supply in the Earth will be very limited and the population will increase, so the production of.
Prabhupāda: Well... We have already predicted in the Bhāgavata there will be no rice, no wheat, no vegetables, no fruit, no milk.
Devotee: Only meat.
Prabhupāda: All they have to eat meat. That is already predicted. What you’re scientists will say?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So now they have started working in the mainland and it is to see, to try to find out the food for the future.
Prabhupāda: Rascal where he is going [indistinct] [laughter] that he does not know and he’s findings food for the future. He is a rascal. Ask him where you are going in future?
Devotees: [laughter]
Prabhupāda: There is no answer. Every point they are simply rascals, mūḍhā. There is a Bengali proverb, tar be kar muni naya, para lokera gunnaya, a boy was to be married so all the neighbourhood friends are invited. So they are always thinking when the marriage will take place, marriage will take place, marriage will take place. The boy who was to be married he has forgotten.
He has forgotten that he is to be married but others they are busy, "When he’ll be married, when he’ll be married," he does not know where he’s going in future. And he’s busy, always future [indistinct]. Where you will live, first of all think. Self-preservation is the first law of nature. So where you will live?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is one of the concepts that almost every scientist is thinking about, they say the gener... After their generation what will my children do, will they survive in the next year is coming ahead? So they always try to do something for their so-called benefit, of the younger generations.
Prabhupāda: Why you are thinking for your generation? That is good question, why? Your generation, your Swāmī is not here, at present. Why you are thinking of your son who will come and take birth? Why you’re thinking like that? What is the answer to this question?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because there is a concept of material bondage.
Prabhupāda: Now if you are thinking for your future generation, why you’re not thinking of your future life? You are thinking for the generation who are expected to come.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.
Prabhupāda: But what you’re doing who are already present?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: They also serves the existence of the soul eternally.
Prabhupāda: Ha. If the soul is eternal then what you are doing for yourself?
Karāndhara: [indistinct] spend their whole lives thinking about the next future generation.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Karāndhara: The future generation will also have to spend their whole lives thinking about the next future generation.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee: It’s all a myth.
Prabhupāda: You must have definite aim, actually what is [indistinct]
Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa. [break]
Prabhupāda: [indistinct] everything is there but why you’re thinking of others to come?
Karāndhara: They don’t like to experience pain.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Karāndhara: They don’t like to experience pain.
Prabhupāda: That’s all right but your experiencing pain but your. The point is why you do not like to experience? What is the answer?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because we are missing the real.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: The real knowledge, we are missing that.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.
Karāndhara: Then what is the answer to that question?
Prabhupāda: The answer is because the soul is there in the body, he is eternal, he is seeking eternal happiness but he’s not getting, being bound up with this body, this is the answer. This is the answer. The soul is there, just like you are repairing the house because you are there, you are there. If you would not have been there, they don’t care for the house. The importance of the body is due to the soul, not the body as it is.
Karāndhara: Why doesn’t the soul like to experience pain?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Karāndhara: Why doesn’t the soul.
Prabhupāda: Because the future combined... The nature is such...ānanda-moya avyasat, part and parcel of God. God is free therefore He is always enjoying rāsa-līlā. I am part and parcel of God I want also freedom like that. That is our point, that you want everything like God but you are now bound up by this material consciousness. Get out of it and you get there. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
You are suffering on account of being attacked by fever. Get out of it. People are working hard to get the body comforts but why you are getting. Trying to get the body comfortable? Because the soul is there. The same picture we have drawn, the bird is in the cage [indistinct] and he’s covering the cage. You’ve seen that picture? He’s simply covering the cage. The material civilisation means they are simply covering the cage and the bird within the cage is died.
That is material civilisation. And they are so foolish that... The cage's importance is because the bird is there. They are simply taking to make the cage useful. Just like [indistinct], the whole program is on the cage, not on the bird. The bird is suffering for want of food. They have no attention for this; they are checking on cage, taking care of cage only. The whole attention is diverted to the cage.
Śyāmasundara: This idea of preparing for the future, it seems natural. Just like you are translating books so that in the future your disciples will have this knowledge.
Prabhupāda: But I have got an aim. I have right aim. But they have no aim.
Śyāmasundara: Ah.
Prabhupāda: I am giving knowledge with the right aim, but they have no right aim. What is the use of their knowledge?
Śyāmasundara: It is natural, then, to think of future generations? [indistinct]
Prabhupāda: No, we are not thinking of future generation; we are thinking of the future of the soul. They are not interested in either future generation. They are, "Why shall I leave my family?"
Śyāmasundara: I mean...Your disciples in the future will benefit from your books.
Prabhupāda: Books for getting the right knowledge, that is a different thing.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: All the activities, both spiritual and the material, Śrīla Prabhupāda, are all done by the soul only. The activities of the soul.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is called... What is called?
Parābhavas tāvad abhodha-jātaḥ
yāvan na jijñāsata ātma-tattvam
[SB 5.5.5].
That is called ātma-tattvam, apaśyatām ātma-tattvam [SB 2.1.2]. That is actual science. The science of spirit, the science of spirit soul. This is knowledge, ātma-tattvam. They do not see, they do not, they have no idea what is spirit, what is the nature of the spirit. How he is happy, how he can become happy, these things they do not know. They are taking care of the bird. Therefore they have been called as go-kharaḥ, cows and asses, animals.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So the difference is in the material platform?
Prabhupāda: Ah.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Since the soul is bound in this material body.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So you take care of the body because the soul is there but don’t forget the soul’s needs.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Hm.
Prabhupāda: That is our movement.
Śyāmasundara: Don’t forget the soul’s?
Prabhupāda: Needs.
Śyāmasundara: Need.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Why you are simply one-sided? You don’t say that don’t take care of the body but our prime necessity is how to take care of the soul.
Yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ [SB 10.84.13]. That’s why we are taking this morning walk, this is taking care of this body but we are taking care of the body for the reason that we shall go back and engage this body in the service of Kṛṣṇa. That is our main objective, it is not that we simply take care of the body and there is no need of Kṛṣṇa consciousness...
We do not say that you... There is no necessity of producing food, there is no necessity of eating, there is no necessity of sleeping we don’t... The karmis they are denying that there is soul or there is God, they have no knowledge. Therefore they are misled. [indistinct]
Devotee: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: The reason this human life is so important.
Prabhupāda: Ha.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because we can think about the. real symptoms of the soul.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Real feature. The huma...the dogs, cats cannot understand what is the real future. The real future is go back to home back to Godhead. That is real future. Not that, "Oh, what my future sons will eat?"
Śyāmasundara: What my future sons will eat. [laughs]
Prabhupāda: Hm.... [engine starting] that is called māyayāpahṛta-jñāna, real knowledge is taken away by the illusory energy.
How is that? Write books. Our books are already there and we have discussed all these points in our purports in so many ways. All politics, sociology, education everything.
[in car]
hari-nāma, hari-nāma, hari-nāma, hari...[break] America is the first class nation but they do not know what is self. They are considering this body as the self. That is material. And when the body is dead, he cries, "Ah my father is gone, my father is gone." But where? Your father is lying there, this body you have seen as the body of your father, as your father, why you’re crying?
What is the answer? And you are thinking of your father’s and your son’s future. The future, everyone’s future is death. However you may arrange for comfortable life you cannot avoid death.
Śyāmasundara: At the time of death most people because they have no clear conception of God or the afterlife. The only, the only conception they have of God is that. He is responsible for the death of my beloved therefore I blame Him. Many people blame God. [break]
Prabhupāda: [Sounds like the tape is going backwards] [indistinct]
Svarūpa Dāmodara: If one understands that this present life is preparation for the next life.
Prabhupāda: Yes that is a fact. Just like a child is meant for boyhood, boyhood is meant for youthhood, youthhood is meant for old age, aged body. Similarly the next body, next future, that they do not know what is next future.
Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa. [indistinct] our constitution is if one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious he has no good qualification...andhā yathāndhair [SB 7.5.31] Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa. [break]
Karāndhara: Well the legal proceedings are ...
Prabhupāda: [indistinct]
Śyāmasundara: We cannot hear you.
Karāndhara: Legal proceedings [indistinct] doing their service [indistinct] [break]
Prabhupāda: [indistinct]
Devotee: No responsibility [indistinct]
Prabhupāda: So you are given freedom, it is my opinion, so you must have [indistinct].
Karāndhara: So in Los Angeles although everyone has a right to vote only 50% of people bother to even vote.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Karāndhara: Because too lazy and they don’t want to even take the time.
Prabhupāda: No. In another sense what is the use of giving votes? They are all rascals.
Śyāmasundara: Everybody thinks like that.
Prabhupāda: I never gave vote.
Devotees: [laughter]
Prabhupāda: Never. All these rascals, why shall I give? Since the independence has been [indistinct] I never vote, give vote anyone. Don’t agree. Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Devotees: Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa [break]
Prabhupāda: You are [indistinct] meeting, even in Vṛndāvana they hold meetings on Rūpa Gosvāmīs birthday or appearance day. I do not agree.
Karāndhara: With the meetings?
Prabhupāda: No, in Vṛndāvana the meetings because I know all these Gosvāmīs like our, what is that? Gosvāmī?. Pūrṇacandra Gosvāmī.
Karāndhara: Pūrṇacandra.
Prabhupāda: All artificial. They have no respect for the Rūpa Gosvāmīor Jīva Gosvāmī. They expect business. Our international society has taken seriously that Caitanya Mahāprabhu [indistinct] spread but they have no such seriousness. They want to utilise Caitanya Mahāprabhu for their belly. Sense gratification.
Śyāmasundara: Hm.
Prabhupāda: Earning money by showing the Deity. "Rādhā-Dāmodara, give me something." And then doing all nonsense, drinking. Instead of serving God, they employ God to their service... [pause] [end]